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Post by Hari Seldon on Oct 11, 2017 4:17:52 GMT
So McGee listed off a few cases for Ducky to choose from. I figured most of them but I'm not sure about the others. Thoughts? Jack in the box could be 'Head Case' (3.15) - when the team finds a box with a head in it when they raid a chop shop. I don't have a theory on Pommel Horse, but it's one of a few names used in gymnastics for the vault piece with a pair of handles on it.
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Post by Llyan (Admin) on Oct 11, 2017 11:31:21 GMT
About 7 hours ago Brian tweeted he’d just tweeted a Ducky/Palmer scene so the predictions that this was David’s exit are premature.
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Post by luckysmom on Oct 11, 2017 12:04:12 GMT
I am not sure it was Ducky's complete exit although if it was I would not be surprised. My first though is that he is either cutting way back his appearances or needs some time out (like a short term leave?). I guess time will tell.
With the departure of MW, now Pauley and possibly David I am once again thinking when is the right time to end the series? Some shows have done very well with cast changes like Law and Order, but if three of the core four are gone it is food for thought.
I thought in general the episode was good - not at the same level as the last two but that intensity would not persist the entire season.
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Post by llyan on Oct 11, 2017 12:53:45 GMT
So McGee listed off a few cases for Ducky to choose from. I figured most of them but I'm not sure about the others. Thoughts? Jack in the box could be 'Head Case' (3.15) - when the team finds a box with a head in it when they raid a chop shop. I don't have a theory on Pommel Horse, but it's one of a few names used in gymnastics for the vault piece with a pair of handles on it. Head Case is a good guess for Jack in the Box. I was thinking the body in the box from Cloak but I think your suggestion is better. I'm at a total loss for Pommel Horse. I can't think of any cases that involved gymnastic equipment or vaulting a body. About the closest I can think of is the body in the duffel bag from South by Southwest. Of course, it is possible that McGee was just making that one up by that point!
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fanthom8
Journeyman Agent
This is somewhat confusing
Posts: 119
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Post by fanthom8 on Oct 11, 2017 17:27:09 GMT
Abby is leaving???, wow cool, now I can get rid of my fast forward button
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Post by llyan on Oct 11, 2017 18:35:29 GMT
It feels like we’ve finally come down off the high from the season premiere and are settling back into the groove of the season with a nice twisty case of the week. Gibbs and McGee’s story thread was largely quiet although I did notice that Gibbs still has a light scar on his cheek. It’s lighter than last week’s episode but it is still there. But considering how much their story overshadowed the first two episodes, I didn't mind that their story took a backseat for an episode.
But on the other hand, we got to pick up a bit of the Ducky thread from last week and we got to see Palmer standing on his own two feet as ME without his mentor. That part was really nice and for as shocked as I was that Ducky was taking the job in NYC, it’s ‘only a semester’ and I feel reassured that Ducky is not gone for good yet although I do think it is paving the way for a reduced role.
I’m really enjoying the tone under George and Frank. The show still has a lot of humor but it feels like grown up humor rather than childish humor we had seen at times. Tim was shown as being Senior Field Agent (Torres deferring to him at the beginning and when they were looking for Higgens in the parking garage) and Bishop pushed until she found the information that ultimately cracked the case, which shows her growth from her time as Boss.
Some general thoughts from memory:
- I don’t blame Torres for wanting to escape Higgens and his conversation with Tim was pretty funny when he tried to convince Tim to take over after he just complained how annoying Higgens was. (Why would I want to take over?)
- But as annoying as he was, he shouldn’t have left Higgens alone, although to be fair, he did call for Higgens as soon as he saw their bad guy show up.
- Loved the call back to past episodes for Tim. I still want to know what Pommel Horse was referring to though…
- I’m surprised that no one mentioned that Tim had been arrested by Sportelli when he and Tony broke into the impound lot during The Inside Man. It would have been a nice call back to when we first met Sportelli and probably surprised Bishop and Torres.
- I was really surprised to see other agents processing the car (with Tim and Nick looking on) without Abby there.
- Having done hot yoga before, I can empathize with Torres having to deal with sweaty yoga man. Although, there’s nothing sexy about a woman who’s just finished a hot yoga class either.
- Loved Torres and Bishop deferring to Tim as SFA before Sportelli turned up and barged down the stairs. A small moment but it shows Torres starting to blend with the team and it shows Tim is SFA instead of telling us he is.
- This is the Palmer I would like to see all the time. He was confident even though he was still slightly flustered by Gibbs. I loved how he stood up to him and told Gibbs he wasn’t down collecting information that would help him determine the angle Higgens was shot.
- So Sportelli left NCIS and kidnapped the woman’s son. Did he have time to make a 4 to 5 hour round trip drive to Harrisburg and back? Or did we bend the space-time continuum?
- Not sure where it fits within the episode but I’m sure that Ducky wasn’t sold on the idea of being a guest lecturer (even though he would love it) until she mentioned writing a book. NCIS and Jimmy might be his familial legacy but writing a book would be his professional legacy.
- Clearly by the time Sportelli kidnapped the woman, he knows he’s screwed and he’s desperate. Seriously, why would he go to a building he owns? He’s been a detective long enough to know that would be one of the first places NCIS would look. Maybe he thought she’d crack and give him the bonds faster under duress. Too bad she never had them.
- I really liked how Tim and Bishop handled their side of the raid. Bishop saw to the mother and child while Tim covered them. And once Bishop got them free, they escorted her out of danger.
- The two times we met Sportelli, I didn’t picture him as a dirty cop. He was a hard ass, yet. But he wasn’t portrayed as dirty, even though Nitro seemed to imply he was dirty all along. But maybe because he was a hard ass, I didn’t find it impossible to believe that he had gone dirty.
And there were little things too that set off warning bells with him. The way he said Detective-Sergeant, he sounded bitter. The comment about guys like them not being able to retire, I didn’t think it was because he was implying he was too dedicated to his job (again, he sounded bitter). And when he arrested the woman before they found her son, that was the final alarm and I wish that they had stood up to him.
- The final scene with Ducky was lovely. You could see that he was trying to convince himself that he was making the right decision. All Gibbs had to do was say the right things to make Ducky realize it was the right decision because it was what he wanted. And I really liked that Gibbs is calling Jimmy ‘Doc.’ It is a nice sign of respect, even if Jimmy does annoy Gibbs at times. Although, to be fair, Ducky annoys Gibbs too!
Overall, a nice solid episode! I gave it a B but I'd say it's more of a B+
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Post by Hari Seldon on Oct 11, 2017 20:05:31 GMT
- But as annoying as he was, he shouldn’t have left Higgens alone, although to be fair, he did call for Higgens as soon as he saw their bad guy show up. We've been seeing that in stakeouts for years with no incident. One person watches from the car while the other takes a nap, goes on a food run, or such. They were supposedly out of sight and watching for the bad guy, not in the line of fire.
- Having done hot yoga before, I can empathize with Torres having to deal with sweaty yoga man. Although, there’s nothing sexy about a woman who’s just finished a hot yoga class either. I have no idea what the difference is between regular yoga and hot yoga, but I remember it being mentioned that Brian D. does yoga for fitness, so it might have been an inside ribbing for him.- This is the Palmer I would like to see all the time. He was confident even though he was still slightly flustered by Gibbs. I loved how he stood up to him and told Gibbs he wasn’t down collecting information that would help him determine the angle Higgens was shot. Most definitely. I never found his (unintentionally) inappropriate comments to be funny anyway. Now if only the writers could remember he has a family.- So Sportelli left NCIS and kidnapped the woman’s son. Did he have time to make a 4 to 5 hour round trip drive to Harrisburg and back? Or did we bend the space-time continuum? I'm pretty sure it's permanently bent in the NCIS universe. There was a series called Stitchers that had an episode where a couple of the characters noticed (for a good reason I won't get in to) that whenever they decided to go to another place they were just there and didn't remember any travel in between. They of course had to verbalize it because on screen it was no different from normal.- The two times we met Sportelli, I didn’t picture him as a dirty cop. He was a hard ass, yet. But he wasn’t portrayed as dirty, even though Nitro seemed to imply he was dirty all along. But maybe because he was a hard ass, I didn’t find it impossible to believe that he had gone dirty. Not dirty in the corrupt for personal gain sense. I thought he might be dirty in the sense of possibly ignoring warrants, coercing confessions, and maybe even planting evidence.And there were little things too that set off warning bells with him. The way he said Detective-Sergeant, he sounded bitter. The comment about guys like them not being able to retire, I didn’t think it was because he was implying he was too dedicated to his job (again, he sounded bitter). And when he arrested the woman before they found her son, that was the final alarm and I wish that they had stood up to him. Wondering how many years he has on the force. He should have a good pension built up, but when they found the address they mentioned use of 401K money (shouldn't it be 403B?). Likewise with Gibbs - depending on whether his Marine and NCIS pensions are combined or separate, he's probably pretty much working for free right now.
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Post by llyan on Oct 11, 2017 23:40:11 GMT
- Having done hot yoga before, I can empathize with Torres having to deal with sweaty yoga man. Although, there’s nothing sexy about a woman who’s just finished a hot yoga class either. I have no idea what the difference is between regular yoga and hot yoga, but I remember it being mentioned that Brian D. does yoga for fitness, so it might have been an inside ribbing for him.I did Vinyasa Style yoga, so it's a little athletic to start. But then the room is heated to 85 degrees and they add humidity. Within fifteen minutes, you're just a puddle of sweat. Great workout and the heat helped with the stretching.
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Post by luckysmom on Oct 12, 2017 1:10:34 GMT
So glad for now we have moved away from experienced personnel being portrayed as incompetent as humor! Hopefully we have seen the end of McGee and Palmer as clowns and the Abby the fourth grader...
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Post by sukismom on Oct 12, 2017 1:23:52 GMT
So glad for now we have moved away from experienced personnel being portrayed as incompetent as humor! Hopefully we have seen the end of McGee and Palmer as clowns and the Abby the fourth grader... From your lips to the god's ears......
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Post by Llyan (Admin) on Oct 12, 2017 1:29:46 GMT
Some general thoughts from memory:
- I don’t blame Torres for wanting to escape Higgens and his conversation with Tim was pretty funny when he tried to convince Tim to take over after he just complained how annoying Higgens was. (Why would I want to take over?)
No longer the insecure green Rookie, our Tim.
- But as annoying as he was, he shouldn’t have left Higgens alone, although to be fair, he did call for Higgens as soon as he saw their bad guy show up.
Sadly it was too late, but might have saved Torres life.
- Loved the call back to past episodes for Tim. I still want to know what Pommel Horse was referring to though…
The only thing I can think of is Corporal Punishment which took place partially in a gym when the team nabbed Werth.
- I’m surprised that no one mentioned that Tim had been arrested by Sportelli when he and Tony broke into the impound lot during The Inside Man. It would have been a nice call back to when we first met Sportelli and probably surprised Bishop and Torres.
Good point, I'd have liked that too. Maybe it was there but got cut for time.
- I was really surprised to see other agents processing the car (with Tim and Nick looking on) without Abby there.
Could be it will tie into her leaving.
- Having done hot yoga before, I can empathize with Torres having to deal with sweaty yoga man. Although, there’s nothing sexy about a woman who’s just finished a hot yoga class either.
Hot Yoga sounds like it defeats the purpose of yoga to me.
- Loved Torres and Bishop deferring to Tim as SFA before Sportelli turned up and barged down the stairs. A small moment but it shows Torres starting to blend with the team and it shows Tim is SFA instead of telling us he is.
Glad Torres is finally meshing with the team rather than fighting it at every turn.
- This is the Palmer I would like to see all the time. He was confident even though he was still slightly flustered by Gibbs. I loved how he stood up to him and told Gibbs he wasn’t down collecting information that would help him determine the angle Higgens was shot.
Me too! Hope it's true.
- So Sportelli left NCIS and kidnapped the woman’s son. Did he have time to make a 4 to 5 hour round trip drive to Harrisburg and back? Or did we bend the space-time continuum?
Bendy time is my guess. I knew right down to my socks, when he wasn't there when Michelle was brought in, that he's the one who murdered Higgins.
- Not sure where it fits within the episode but I’m sure that Ducky wasn’t sold on the idea of being a guest lecturer (even though he would love it) until she mentioned writing a book. NCIS and Jimmy might be his familial legacy but writing a book would be his professional legacy.
David wrote a book so I kinda love the idea of Ducky writing one too.
- Clearly by the time Sportelli kidnapped the woman, he knows he’s screwed and he’s desperate. Seriously, why would he go to a building he owns? He’s been a detective long enough to know that would be one of the first places NCIS would look. Maybe he thought she’d crack and give him the bonds faster under duress. Too bad she never had them.
This thought. Once he got the bonds (if, of course, she had them) she was a dead woman and her young son was too. No way could Sportelli keep him alive.
- I really liked how Tim and Bishop handled their side of the raid. Bishop saw to the mother and child while Tim covered them. And once Bishop got them free, they escorted her out of danger.
- The two times we met Sportelli, I didn’t picture him as a dirty cop. He was a hard ass, yet. But he wasn’t portrayed as dirty, even though Nitro seemed to imply he was dirty all along. But maybe because he was a hard ass, I didn’t find it impossible to believe that he had gone dirty.
Same here. He was a bit of a jerk but I didn't peg him [back then] as a dirty cop. He reminded me a bit of Tony's Major at Baltimore PD. I didn't get that he was dirty until that camera shot on the Tony, Danny, "Major" photo. Sportelli was really the only viable suspect. The others, Benny & the former cop (who fingered Sportelli) were too obvious and their "reveals" were too early for them to be the "one".
And there were little things too that set off warning bells with him. The way he said Detective-Sergeant, he sounded bitter. The comment about guys like them not being able to retire, I didn’t think it was because he was implying he was too dedicated to his job (again, he sounded bitter). And when he arrested the woman before they found her son, that was the final alarm and I wish that they had stood up to him.
I had issue too. I mean I'd figured it out and Sportelli being suddenly so hard arse about a subordinate he'd cared about was jarring. Using "Gibbs won't like it" rather than invoking protest in their own names made them seem weak.
- The final scene with Ducky was lovely. You could see that he was trying to convince himself that he was making the right decision. All Gibbs had to do was say the right things to make Ducky realize it was the right decision because it was what he wanted. And I really liked that Gibbs is calling Jimmy ‘Doc.’ It is a nice sign of respect, even if Jimmy does annoy Gibbs at times. Although, to be fair, Ducky annoys Gibbs too!
It came across to me that Ducky felt rather un-needed now. Gibbs method of getting Ducky to go needed some tweaking.
The Jimmy/Ducky hug is what I expected from Tony/Ducky. It was beautiful. Their formal handshake felt totally impersonal.
Overall, a nice solid episode! I gave it a B but I'd say it's more of a B+
I like + and - grades. I'd have gone for B+ or A-.
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Post by pdsmith777 on Oct 12, 2017 2:12:26 GMT
I'm not sure why the "Pommel Horse" case is giving everybody fits and the "Body Inside the Body" isn't. Clearly both cases were prior to the beginning of the show. That's been done before. Last year when Palmer was digitizing the old autopsy files onto the NCIS servers, Ducky quizzed him on a case that was prior to show starting. There was NCIS prior to the show beginning, so of course there would be cases prior also. This even goes back to the beginning of season 3 prior to Ziva arriving during "Mind Games" with a case prior to DiNozzo. Not all references are going to be cases we're familiar with.
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Post by llyan on Oct 12, 2017 2:43:22 GMT
I'm not sure why the "Pommel Horse" case is giving everybody fits and the "Body Inside the Body" isn't. Clearly both cases were prior to the beginning of the show. That's been done before. Last year when Palmer was digitizing the old autopsy files onto the NCIS servers, Ducky quizzed him on a case that was prior to show starting. There was NCIS prior to the show beginning, so of course there would be cases prior also. This even goes back to the beginning of season 3 prior to Ziva arriving during "Mind Games" with a case prior to DiNozzo. Not all references are going to be cases we're familiar with. I realize that Body in a Body was prior to the show. Gibbs said that the case was before McGee when he arrived to announce they had a case. But since all of the other cases McGee listed were identifiable to episodes, I assumed that Pommel Horse is also from an episode. That is unless he (or the writers) added that one to mess with Bishop (or the fans). Right now, I'm leaning towards: the writers threw that one in to mess with the fans.
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Post by Hari Seldon on Oct 12, 2017 4:20:22 GMT
I'm not sure why the "Pommel Horse" case is giving everybody fits and the "Body Inside the Body" isn't. Clearly both cases were prior to the beginning of the show. That's been done before. Last year when Palmer was digitizing the old autopsy files onto the NCIS servers, Ducky quizzed him on a case that was prior to show starting. There was NCIS prior to the show beginning, so of course there would be cases prior also. This even goes back to the beginning of season 3 prior to Ziva arriving during "Mind Games" with a case prior to DiNozzo. Not all references are going to be cases we're familiar with. I realize that Body in a Body was prior to the show. Gibbs said that the case was before McGee when he arrived to announce they had a case. But since all of the other cases McGee listed were identifiable to episodes, I assumed that Pommel Horse is also from an episode. That is unless he (or the writers) added that one to mess with Bishop (or the fans). Right now, I'm leaning towards: the writers threw that one in to mess with the fans. Body in a body was actually said to be before Palmer and McGee joined up, but we're led to believe McGee was around for the cases he named. However, it's also reasonable to believe there were cases handled by the team that were not in episodes. If a gymnast enlisted, then was killed due to failure of a piece of gym equipment, it's possible it had an interesting autopsy but didn't merit an episode.
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Post by Hari Seldon on Oct 12, 2017 17:29:50 GMT
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