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Post by nas on Oct 24, 2018 4:01:25 GMT
O - M - G!!
I just saw that Gina Lucita Monreal wrote this episode!
I do believe she wrote some real stinko episodes in the past - ones I just thought that were incrediby dumb...(🤔 can’t remember the particular eps atm...)
but she did an incredible job with this story! and like I said before, everyone in the cast played their part to perfection - everyone!
nas
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Post by mchnelson on Oct 24, 2018 4:24:48 GMT
Shame the Sox v Dodgers game was on, hope "ordinary" people do video it for later watching or the figures won't reflect how good this episode was. As a Brit who watched Dr Who this weekend, that had a story about Rosa Parks and then this episode about Vietnam, I'm certainly getting my fill of US history.
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Post by Hari Seldon on Oct 24, 2018 4:30:38 GMT
As has already been said, a good episode.
Not meant as any kind of complaint or nit pick, but at the end when Jennings faces Fletcher, Dryer looks almost a foot taller than Robinson and supposedly there's only 3 inches difference. As a matter of fact, Robinson should be halfway between the heights of Dryer and Harmon, but it looks the other way around here.
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Post by Llyan (Admin) on Oct 24, 2018 5:01:53 GMT
As has already been said, a good episode.
Not meant as any kind of complaint or nit pick, but at the end when Jennings faces Fletcher, Dryer looks almost a foot taller than Robinson and supposedly there's only 3 inches difference. As a matter of fact, Robinson should be halfway between the heights of Dryer and Harmon, but it looks the other way around here.
As we get older many of us, unfortunately, begin to shrink. Could be the case with Mr. Robinson or it could have been a filming choice for the characters.
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Post by mchnelson on Oct 24, 2018 5:58:14 GMT
Where did money for the chairs in the lab come from, or did Kasie “borrow” them from evidence? Guess they used the set for the prison Library, so easier to move things in and out having the Lab set like that between takes. Episode must have been good as I don’t see complaints about the looks between Bishop and Nick or the hand holding between Gibbs and Jack. Not just on here but other forums I visit. Shouldn’t Frank Dryer’s character be arrested for falsehoods?
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Post by llyan on Oct 24, 2018 12:47:56 GMT
To me it was there best episode since “Heartland” and “Heartland” was their best since “Call of Silence”. Yes, there were a lot I loved over the years but these 3 are standouts. Wow! I don’t think I’ve ever seen this many A grades! I almost put in an A+ grade for this one because I thought it was that good!
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Post by verdun on Oct 24, 2018 12:49:27 GMT
As a Viet Nam vet, this episode hit home in a way others don't. Good job by the writer and excellent job by the actors (although the Laurel bit was overdone). Even liked Fred Dryer is this episode, and I've never considered him much of an actor.
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Post by Llyan (Admin) on Oct 24, 2018 14:48:55 GMT
Where did money for the chairs in the lab come from, or did Kasie “borrow” them from evidence? Guess they used the set for the prison Library, so easier to move things in and out having the Lab set like that between takes. Episode must have been good as I don’t see complaints about the looks between Bishop and Nick or the hand holding between Gibbs and Jack. Not just on here but other forums I visit. Shouldn’t Frank Dryer’s character be arrested for falsehoods? The statute of limitation had expired decades ago.
Yes, I'd say those chairs were from the evidence garage.
Sets get repurposed all the time since it would be a waste of money to build all new sets. Tony's Baltimore apartment was re-used from Vance's office - a lot of scenes are shot on the "brick" wall behind his desk.
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Post by SunshineBoozer on Oct 24, 2018 16:44:10 GMT
Shame the Sox v Dodgers game was on, hope "ordinary" people do video it for later watching or the figures won't reflect how good this episode was.
I was surprised they (as Hubby put it) "wasted a new episode", opposite Game 1.
Hubby, his Mom, and I all enjoyed this episode. The first time I can say that, this season. Mom even stayed awake through the whole show.
As to that sporting event, even though it is a stoning offence here, I don't care who wins as long as it's over in 4 games.
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Post by pdsmith777 on Oct 24, 2018 17:21:05 GMT
I watched the episode a second time. I’ve made a few notes.
TEASER – Well acted by the two unknowns. Great introduction to the episode, sets it up well and introduces us to Dee Wallace, who was wonderful in this. She was very believable and genuine in this role.
ACT I – I agree, the viral audio bit should have been given an antibiotic at the beginning and done away with. The running gag did not work.
I still don’t like Kasie. She hasn’t grown on me, and this was a bad episode for her. She’s still just a toned down version of Abby and I’m not liking it. Wished they had gone a very different direction with PP replacement. Nothing against the actress, just wanting something very different.
The episode continues after our interruption, with Harmon and Wallace together. These one on one scenes where they let the actors do their thing are great. And just about everyone in this episode was fantastic.
ACT II – Kasie’s presentation didn’t work for me, but it was a necessary scene to set up the later scene between Gibbs and Jack.
Again, a one on one with Gibbs and Jack that was very well done between them.
The court yard scene, the confined space and claustrophobic feeling was a great setting for the three actors. McGee’s enthusiasm with offering hope to the character of Jennings then being quickly dashed set the tone between the two character’s developing relationship quite well.
ACT III – The only scene where Bishop and Torres were used well with Dryer. While Dryer was a so-so Hunter, he did good in this role. I was impressed.
The scene with Jack and Gibbs watching Kasie’s presentation was just an emotional kick in the gut.
*Personal Note – I have no idea what the producers plan to do with the relationship between the characters. I will say that whatever type of relationship is forming, it is going at the right pace. The, so far, year long working relationship has grown into mutual respect, they are both combat veterans, she is a former POW and both have their demons they have dealt with.
I had/have no problem with Jack taking Gibbs hand in an emotional moment. People do that. The characters were reliving their own experiences while listening to the experience of another fire fight. It was a perfectly natural thing for her to do.
If it leads somewhere (which it might or might not) as long as the progression is believable, I’ll be good with it.
Gibbs/McGee/Jennings in the library, again a confined space, was wonderfully done by the three actors. I just wanted to cry out, “Please, more of this for the rest of the season!”
The Gibbs/McGee/Vance confrontation in Vance’s office was classic old Gibbs, barging into the director’s office. Loved it, and McGee on Gibb’s heals was great to see as well as his maturity standing up to Vance.
ACT IV - Autopsy with Palmer and McGee, very touching and well played again.
{I’ll say this only once, This is a time I miss Tony. He and Palmer had a unique and believable working relationship, and I can easily see him playing this scene, without the reference of a military father}
Lab with Bishop/Torres/Kasie, only purpose to give Gibbs the engraved brass plate.
Harmon and Wallace together again. They were so great together.
Vance/Gibbs/Jack in Vance’s office. Confrontation between the characters is good. Jack being able to bring the two Alpha dogs back to reality is unique.
Again, the prison library with McGee and Jenkins. Great performances with the two actors.
ACT V – One of the best last acts ever. The scene between Palmer and Kasie was necessary only for Palmer to tell her she’s a part of the team. The rest of the scenes were impactful and brilliantly acted by all. Including Sam, the guard.
I didn’t realize Dryer towered over Harmon, and Harmon is tall.
This one was a great episode. I’ll have to figure where it sits on my personal list. “Call of Silence” is still the best. This one sits somewhere around “Truth or Consequences”, “SWAK”, “The Tie That Binds”, and “Off the Grid”. Just going to have to think about this one. But it’s one of the best.
Problems with the episode.
Kasie.
The viral audio recording, and the muffin. (although used well for Gibbs apology)
Lack of useful purpose for Torres or Bishop.
If Ray was being held in Leavenworth, how much does it cost to fly back and forth from Kansas City to DC. As compared to exhuming a body?
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Post by BobNOTinValencia on Oct 24, 2018 19:29:34 GMT
My only nitpick with this one is... how old is Tim supposed to be in NCIS-world? Sean is 40, and the Vietnam war ended 43 years ago, yet he sounded (to me) like he had seen his father's changes when the Admiral came home, and missed the "old" dad, whom he would have never even met... thought maybe the old Marine would call him on that, and he would have to explain that he heard it from the family and others.
Other than that little point sticking in my mind, the rest of the show was full of great performances by some wonderful older actors who I hadn't seen in a while, along with some very touching moments within the team and between Mark and Dee (and what I thought was a stupid, ongoing viral audio gag... but someone else said was a needed relief from the weight of the episode, so I guess I will let it slide a bit)
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Post by Llyan (Admin) on Oct 24, 2018 20:47:16 GMT
I think Tim was born circa 1977. He may have tried to talk to his dad about it when he hit Middle School/Junior High and it was mentioned in a history class. Or Tim saw his uniforms and medals.
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Post by pdsmith777 on Oct 24, 2018 20:52:29 GMT
I could break this episode down scene by scene like I’ve done with other episodes, but I’m not going to this time...
every. - single. - performance. by everyone was just perfect! I cannot say more...
if there was anything wrong with this episode I don’t know what it was... it was so emotional on so many levels, I just cried... 😢
nas To me it was there best episode since “Heartland” and “Heartland” was their best since “Call of Silence”. Yes, there were a lot I loved over the years but these 3 are standouts. Wow! I don’t think I’ve ever seen this many A grades! I think the reason for so many "A's" is due to the fact that for the past 18 to 24 months the episodes have been less than overwhelming. So when a good one comes along, it's recognized and appreciated.
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Post by llyan on Oct 24, 2018 20:58:03 GMT
My only nitpick with this one is... how old is Tim supposed to be in NCIS-world? Sean is 40, and the Vietnam war ended 43 years ago, yet he sounded (to me) like he had seen his father's changes when the Admiral came home, and missed the "old" dad, whom he would have never even met... thought maybe the old Marine would call him on that, and he would have to explain that he heard it from the family and others. Other than that little point sticking in my mind, the rest of the show was full of great performances by some wonderful older actors who I hadn't seen in a while, along with some very touching moments within the team and between Mark and Dee (and what I thought was a stupid, ongoing viral audio gag... but someone else said was a needed relief from the weight of the episode, so I guess I will let it slide a bit) They gave Tim's birthday in House Divided last year as September 13, 1978 which is only slightly off from Sean's real birthday of November 15, 1977. So the character just turned 40.
To me, it didn't sound like Tim was implying that he knew his father before the war. I'm pretty sure he never really knew his father at all. I seem to recall Tim saying something (possibly to Tony) about the Admiral being an enigma to him. We know that he was abrasive, demanding, and emotionally closed off man. Penny once tried to convince Tim to call his father after the bombing at the Navy Yard because she knew he'd like to hear from his son. And she also tried to convince a skeptical Tim that his father really loved him. Tim even compared his father to The Great Santini once.
Considering his conversation with Palmer where Tim said he had a lot of regrets regarding his father, I think that Tim has spent a lot of time trying to figure out what he could have done to improve his relationship with the Admiral. Perhaps it was even this case that helped him to realize that his father's time serving in Vietnam was a defining moment in his father's life. And even though Ray did open up to him, Tim still can never use this information to fix things between him and his father, which is kinda sad when you think about it. Since his father is dead, he'll never be able to fix their relationship, but very much like Tim to continue to try to figure out how to solve the problem even if it is in vain.
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Post by Llyan (Admin) on Oct 25, 2018 0:22:43 GMT
The most significant memory I have about Tim and his dad is the story he told Tony: He’d made a birthday card for “The Admiral” when he was a kid only to have it handed back to him and told “you can do better”. What a horrible thing for a parent to do to a child. 😢
It bothered me with both Tim and Tony is that in adulthood they were both made to feel like they had to do all the work to fix their relationships. Both the Admiral and Senior remained incredibly self-centered and, along with their co-workers, expected their sons to make all the effort.
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